Graphic by Meher Yeda.

[“We Don’t Talk About Bruno,” from Encanto]

Trent: Hello everyone, and welcome to Episode One of Pop Chaos, your one-stop shop for pop culture. If you did your homework, you just listened to episode zero. We’re not introducing ourselves again. But I’m Trent.

Bailey: I’m Bailey and you just said we’re not going to introduce ourselves, yet here we are.

Trent: This week we’re talking about Spider-Man, right? No Way Home.

Bailey: We are going to talk about a lot of things. Spider-Man

Trent: Encanto.

Bailey: Encanto for sure.

Trent: What was the other thing?

Bailey: There were some other things we were going to talk about.

Trent (overlapping): Such as?

Bailey: For one, Elmo, I wanted to bring up.

Trent: Oh yeah, you need to explain to me what is going on with Elmo.

Bailey: Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then maybe just like some, some other shows that are big and coming up right now. I was thinking about mentioning, you know, Succession. Euphoria season two is coming out.

Trent: Oh yeah, have not seen Succession.

Bailey: Well, I don’t know. The big two we’re gonna talk about are Encanto and Spider-Man-slash-Andrew Garfield. The resurgence. He’s big right now. Very big.

Trent: That’s true. Should we – we should just get right into Spider-Man. He is huge, actually, on Twitter and like TikTok. There – I saw a tweet that was like, “The K-Pop-ification of Andrew Garfield.” I think people were like, “Stream The Amazing Spider-Man,” to get him that recognition.

Bailey: Well, so I’m curious. I just want to double-check real quick how old he is.

Trent (overlapping): We’ll embed that.

Bailey: I want to check how old he is.

Trent (overlapping): He’s like in his late 30s, I want to say.

Bailey: Ooh! So I looked him up on Google.

Trent (in the background): 45.

Bailey: And unfortunately, he’s shorter than both of us. That's … yeah…

Trent (gasping): With his hair, it’s fine.

Bailey: He’s 5’10”. That's true. His hair like defies gravity, so.

Trent: Wait, no but how old is he?

Bailey: He is 38 years old.

Trent: What’d I tell you? Late 30s.

Bailey: Yeah, he looks great for his age. Did you watch – sorry, we were gonna talk about Spider-Man. But did you watch tick, tick… BOOM!, because it’s on topic?

Trent: No, so I saw like the trailer.

Bailey (in the background): Okay.

Trent: I did not – okay. Not to bring up Andrew Garfield’s hair again. I cannot get past his hair in the trailer. It looks, I think personally –

Bailey: It looks like Jonathan Larson’s hair though, who he’s portraying.

Trent (overlapping): I know. But that doesn’t mean I like it.

Bailey: Okay. So you’re just not gonna watch the entire movie because of his hair? It was too bouncy?

Trent: Correct.

Bailey: It did … it did look…

Trent: It looks like he’s like a mad scientist and it blew up.

Bailey: Yeah, it looks like he touched one of those little balls that makes you – WOOOOO!

Trent: Those electric balls –

Bailey (joking): But like not in a gay way. Yeah, and it also –

Trent (laughing): …Bailey…

Bailey: I dunno, it also looks like … I don’t know, I think it looked kind of bouncy, kind of good, like kind of shampoo commercial sort of… Yeah.

Trent (overlapping): Anyway, Spider-Man: No Way Home.

Bailey (in the background): Yeah, enough about Andrew Garfield’s hair.

Trent: Andrew Garfield’s done. What did you think of No Way Home?

Bailey (overlapping): Well okay, first off, spoiler alert. Like if you have not seen it.

Trent: Oh, yeah, obviously. If you haven’t seen Spider-Man or Encanto, we’re talking about both of those.

Bailey: Yeah, let me not shame you though because if you don’t want to go to the movie theater right now, that is a-okay. But also, what are you doing? You got to see this g-dang movie. I don’t know. I… I did like, I binge-watched all the other Spider-Man movies.

Trent (overlapping): Like all – like, all seven of them?

Bailey: Yeah, pretty much. For the most – yeah, I think I missed a couple the first time around. But then after the movie, I watched – I’ve seen all of them. Mostly, my goal was to re-watch the Tobey [McGuire] ones because I was never a huge fan of those. So I had to re-watch them.

Trent (overlapping): Not that.

Bailey: I’m so sorry. I’m so sorry.

Trent: It’s okay. So I’m actually on the – well, I know I’ve definitely seen the Tobey ones. I actually don’t know if I’ve seen Andrew Garfield. Sorry.

Bailey (overlapping): Are you f-ing serious?

Trent: And I know for a fact that I have not seen Spider-Man: Homecoming or Spider-Man: Far From Home. I did not see those.

Bailey (overlapping): How are we friends? And you went to go see No Way Home?

Trent: Yeah, cuz my friends were going and I was like, “Lemme…”

Bailey: You… so if your friends jumped off a bridge, would you do it too? Is that what I’m hearing?

Trent: I would. Listen, why are they jumping off the bridge, you know?

Bailey: Trent. Trent: No Way Home, because he’s jumping off a literal bridge, yeah.

Trent (in the background): Let’s investigate. Investigative journalism. I would. But I liked it.

Bailey: No, I'm sorry. Okay. On Tobey Maguire’s Spider-Man. I like them. I like them. I appreciate them, the nostalgia. The first one I think is really great. Mary Jane slayed. Her hair … I love her. This is literally the most irrelevant thing to the actual movies, but I love her hair in the first movie like the dark like orange. I love it. The third movie, I … it’s painful to watch. It’s really, really hard to watch.

Trent: It’s been a while but I looked at the Rotten Tomatoes scores like a while ago and it’s like the lowest by far. I’m like, what happened to that movie?

Bailey: Yeah, well, I don’t, I don’t dictate my life and what I watch by Rotten Tomatoes scores.

Trent: Oh no, I don’t either.

Bailey: Because I think that they – no yeah – I think they totally lie all the time –

Trent (in the background): For the reporting. For the reporting.

Bailey: And I’m a huge fan of a good bad movie. You literally can look behind me here.

Trent (in the background): Oh, for sure.

Bailey: There’s a Ma poster on the wall. It’s one of the best good-bad movies ever made. But the third Spider-Man movie is genuinely just too hard to watch. Like I had to look away when he’s doing the whole walk down the street. He’s got like the “Where are you?” emo hair. I can’t, he looks so greasy!

Trent (in the background): That is so funny! His weird emo hair? It’s so bad.

Bailey: Yeah, so I don’t know.

Trent: Okay, my question – who is your Spider-Man? Like out of the three, who is your Spider-Man?

Bailey: I think you know the answer to that.

Trent: Well then why don’t you say it?

Bailey: It’s Andrew Garfield.

Trent: Of course. Mine is Tobey.

Bailey: Because I grew up, I – Okay, I loved the Andrew Garfield Spider-Mans and I always had to defend them and I’m so glad that people are finally recognizing that he is amazing. Like I’m sorry, the second one was a hot mess, there was just too much going on. That’s not his fault though. Acting-wise, he ate. He ate and the thing for me is, for Andrew Garfield Spider-Man … especially like … the characters have so much chemistry. They do, specifically Gw– you have to, like you have to watch them. The Andrew Garfield –

Trent: Wait, I actually think I saw the first one cuz I remember the scene where like he’s at Gwen’s house for dinner. That’s all I remember though.

Bailey: Yeah, eating the branzino. The fish. Yeah, so the first like for example, the first Spider-Man, when I'm watching like Toby like I watched all three of those movies … I did fall asleep a little bit during the second one … I’m so sorry.

Trent (overlapping): Of course. You missed the lore, you missed the most important part, missed Doc Ock’s background.

Bailey: I’m so sorry! I did like the second one, though. But, it didn’t make me feel that much. It really didn’t, and I love Willem Dafoe too, like he's one of my favorite actors. I love him in like some of my favorite video games like Beyond Two Souls. He’s amazing. He’s such a good actor. He slayed in No Way Home. He was so good. But the gag is is that –

Trent: What’s the gag?

Bailey: The gag is that the Andrew Garfield’s Spider-Man makes me feel so much, like I cried twice. I cried when Uncle Ben dies. It makes you feel so much, like they build up so much with the characters. When like Uncle Ben died in Tobey’s movies, I did not cry, I didn’t feel anything.

Trent (sarcastic): Uncle Ben died? *gasp*

Bailey: *gasp* Guys, I’m so sorry! So sorry!

Trent: Iconic Spider-Man moment, oops!

Bailey: Oh my God, Spider-Man wears red and blue? Oh my God!

Trent: Wait, he’s a spider? And a man?

Bailey: Wait, a spider bit him? Oh, god… No, but literally like it makes me feel so much. And Gwen, like Emma – Emma Stone is incredible.

Trent: That’s true, she’s great as Gwen.

Bailey: I just rewatched Easy A because I’ve been seeing so many Gwen Stacy edits and I was like, “I love this woman and I need to rewatch.” Because she just, she ate. She’s so good, and she and Andrew, obviously they dated. All the Spider-Mans, they’ve all like dated their Mary Janes or whatever.

Trent (overlapping): They did? I didn’t know that. Oh, I guess that makes sense.

Bailey: Yeah, they all have. Really? Yeah, MJ and Tobey – like Tobey and Kirsten Dunst dated, Andrew Garfield and Emma Stone dated, and now Tom Holland and Zendaya, yeah.

Trent: Wait, iconic.

Bailey: Yeah, so. But I don’t know. I just think that Gwen and Andrew had the best chemistry, and they were so, so good. And I love those movies so much.

Trent: That’s fair, that’s fair. I would say mine is Tobey, just because that’s the one I remember seeing, that's what I grew up on. And I have not, I don’t know. Andrew Garfield, when I watched it at the time, doesn’t hit for me. That was like seven years ago, so I don't remember. Tom Holland, straight up did not see any of them.

Bailey: Okay, he’s good. I think they were just … they kind of got off to a slow start, in my opinion.

Trent: I think … do you think it’s weird that … I feel like it's a requirement for Spider-Man to have thin lips. Have you noticed that? I noticed that in No Way Home, they all have tiny little stick lips.

Bailey: Trent, Trent, Trent! When I tell you that I saw … so I saw No Way Home twice. And when I was watching with my brother, I had to lean over to him halfway through and, like for the record I have very small lips. Not Spider-Man small but pretty small. But, I leaned over to my brother who was watching with me and I was like, I think they might have like one-and-a-half pair of lips between all three of them.

Trent (in the background): Literally!

Bailey: I was like, “Bert …” And like not to shame for their – like, they’re all very attractive, beautiful men, but I was like, “This is a pattern. This is for sure a pattern.”

Trent: It’s – we’re just observing their faces.

Bailey: Yeah. And they’re all, again, they’re very attractive men. But it's just a pattern. Like for some reason, like I don't know if the spider just like [slurp] sucked all the lip. Like just sucked the lusciousness out of their lips.

Trent: It’s like the opposite of lip fillers.

Bailey: Yeah, the spider bite is actually the opposite of lip fillers, so if you’re wanting smaller lips, fun fact…

Trent: Go get bit by a spider. That’s a joke! For medical purposes, for legal purposes. Don’t get bit by a spider.

Bailey: Don’t. Well, if you want to, you can come to my apartment because we had a spider problem at the beginning of the year. My address is – no, I’m just kidding. I want your general thoughts on the movie though.

Trent: I liked it. It was fun. It wasn’t like my mind was blown. But it was fun. It was, it was nice seeing all of the … not the enemies but the villains from the – pff, the enemies – the bad guys from the other movies. I thought that was really fun. Especially the Tobey ones because it's been a while for them. And of course, oh my gosh, in the theater when Andrew Garfield entered like everyone went crazy.

Bailey: Yuuup, yeah. At my theater, too.

Trent: And then not as many people went crazy for Tobey, but I went crazy for Tobey.

Bailey: Yeah, spoilers, but everyone went crazy for Andrew. Everyone went crazy for Tobey at mine. Everyone went crazy for –

Trent (in the background): Tom Holland! No.

Bailey (laughing): Daredevil for all like… yeah. Oh my god, when Iron Man came back? It was crazy!

Trent (in the background): You can’t say that!

Bailey: Oh my god, when Snape killed Dumbledore!

Trent: Spoiler! We’re not talking about Harry Potter here.

Bailey: No, but okay, my general thoughts on the movie. Okay, so when I rate like … so fun fact about me, I rate movies and I post them on my Instagram story for like the three people that actually care about them. And when I rate Marvel movies on my story, I definitely do it like compared to other Marvel movies. It’s not like –

Trent: That’s fair. Oh yeah, ‘cuz they’re all like, just fun. They’re all like, not serious.

Bailey: Yeah. Yes. So I don't people know that but that's what I do when I'm rating them. I just like compare them to other similar movies, and I gave it a nine out of 10 and that’s because I kind of had low expectations. I thought like … well, what I thought all of like, I wanted to lower expectations so that I could get excited, but like I thought that they were going to make it super fan service-y, which like it was a little bit, but like I felt like the plot like justified it.

Trent (in the background): It was coherent, it made sense.

Bailey: It was super coherent. Exactly, exactly.

Trent: Okay, speaking of ratings, what did you rate Encanto? Because I feel like we should move on.

Bailey: Okay, wait, last thing. Last thing before we talk about Encanto because Spider-Man: No Way Home gets me passionate, but I was just gonna say that I think Andrew carried with the acting.

Trent: Okay, I can see that.

Bailey: Sorry. I do think he was the funniest. He improvised lines. I watched a couple interviews …

Trent: He improvised the “I love you,” right?

Bailey: He improvised the “I love you” line. He ate. When he was talking about Uncle Ben, he teared up, I started tearing up. When he saves Zendaya and he was crying.

Trent (in the background): Oh my God. Callback.

Bailey: Do you know what I mean? When he saved MJ.

Trent (in the background): Yeah, that was great.

Bailey: Oh my god, I got so emotional. He brought the emotion to that, in my opinion. And he was the funniest, which are the two things that I care about most so I thought he definitely carried.

Trent: Okay.

Bailey: Encanto.

Trent: Encanto.

Bailey: You go first. You – give me your thoughts.

Trent: Give me your thoughts? Um, I really liked Encanto. I thought it was a lot of fun. I mean, okay, first things first it is a Disney movie, so it is pretty straightforward. Once again, I have to preface this with I know that it is literally a children’s movie. But I did not like that they – I felt like they did a lot of telling and not showing. Like, especially for the family members and the first song. They literally have a song that's like, here's this family member and here's their like superpower. Well they’re not superpowers but you know what I mean. And it’s like, “Okay, why don’t you show us that” instead of having Stephanie Beatriz sing about it, you know what I mean?

But that was, I would say that was my one gripe with it. I thought it was, that it was really fun. I thought it was really endearing. The music is really good. I was surprised at how good the music was. And, yeah, I love that Disney movies are branching … they’re not just all, you know, American. I like that it’s a little bit more representative of actual, real-world people. So yeah, highly recommended. If you have Disney+, go watch it. So, what did you think of Encanto?

Bailey: Yeah, so I can see what you're saying with the first song, again I'd have to go back and watch it because I don't know, for some reason the whole like first half didn't stick with me as much. I think maybe that's why, cause there's a lot of like exposition. That’s the right word, right?

Trent: That’s fair. Yeah, it was like, “Here’s our family. Here’s where we live. Here’s what’s going on. Oh yeah, here’s Maribel. Spoiler alert: she has no gift. Everyone hates her.” No, just kidding. Just her grandma.

Bailey: I mean, the cast? So good. Stephanie, I think, Beatriz is incredible. Loved her in Orange Is the New Black, watched that in middle school. So good. What’s her face? Oh no, Diane Guerrero! She's one from Orange is the New Black and what's her face? Yeah, Stephanie is from Brooklyn Nine-Nine and other things. Flip those two and their projects, but they're so incredible. I love them both.

Trent: Oh my gosh, they're so good. The cast is so well …

Bailey: Sid the Sloth slayed as Bruno.

Trent: No, for real.

Bailey: So good. So good. And Bruno was kind of cute. I'm not gonna lie. Bruno was kind of fine. Sorry. I had to put it out there.

Trent: Okay.

Bailey: In my humble opinion.

Trent: So, just, if there was someone living in your walls listening to your every move …

Bailey: I would want them to look like Bruno. Was that the question?

Trent: Would you get with that person, yes or no?

Bailey: Well, besides all the spiders … all the spiders and cockroaches and stuff in our walls, yeah. If there was a person as well, I would want them to look like Bruno. *laughs* So if anyone’s listening right now …

Trent (laughing): Not gonna unpack that.

Bailey: No but, okay, going off of Bruno, like …

Trent: I like Bruno. The final song, when he started singing I was like, “Okay, Lin-Manuel Miranda.”

Bailey: I was going to say …

Trent: And then I looked up the Wikipedia cast list. It’s not Lin-Manuel.

Bailey: I didn't even sound like him.

Trent: To me, it sounded 100% like him.

Bailey: It didn't sound like him, it sounded like the part was written for Lin to sing.

Trent (overlapping): Oh, fully. 100%.

Bailey: I know that Lin was crying and shitting bricks when he did not get on the cast.

Trent: I’ve seen so many memes and Tweets that are like, “You know someone had to tie him down to stop him from casting himself as Bruno.” And no shame against that. I mean, as you should.

Bailey: Yeah no, he definitely ate. I would say some more thoughts … it evoked so many emotions within me, which is what I really want from a movie like that. I’m for sure, on the down-low, kind of a Disney adult, at least like with these movie musicals. I love Frozen. I love Frozen II. I literally have Frozen II on vinyl behind me over there. I love the soundtrack so much. “Lost in the Woods” by Jonathan Groff was on my top songs for 2020. So incredible. Moana also. So that's the thing for me … comparing Moana, which is another Lin-Manuel Miranda project, in terms of soundtrack, I don’t think [Encanto] lived up to the soundtrack. I think Moana had a better soundtrack in my opinion. But I do think that this movie made me far more emotional. Like, oh my God, when Bruno showed his little extended table that he had with the rest of them.

Trent (literally yelling): That was so sad. And he had carved a plate into it.

Bailey: I sobbed. I sobbed and at the end, for like the last half an hour straight, I just had tears in my eyes. It made me so emotional. It was such an incredible movie overall, but there was something … I was gonna say something else about it. I have a lot of thoughts.

Trent: I’m sure you do.

Bailey: Yeah, I have a lot of thoughts about everything.

Trent: Should we talk about the music?

Bailey: Well, okay, before we talk about the music, I will say the one thing that – and I talked to my friend about this as well, we were texting about it and she had the same thought – is we both thought that they weren’t gonna get their powers back at the end. We thought that that was like, the whole point is that they kind of realized that they were all that they needed. They didn’t need these magic powers. And then it was like BOOP and our powers are back. And we were just kind of like, “Oh.”

Trent: No, for real. I definitely feel like the ending was a little bit, I don’t wanna say forced, but a little bit rushed. For sure. Just because the movie is already … it’s like over two hours. [Editor’s Note: Encanto’s runtime is 102 minutes.]

Bailey: They fit so much. To be fair, it's kinda like No Way Home. They fit so much into one movie.

Trent (overlapping): No, for real, they fit so much into that movie.

Bailey: So creds. Creds.

Trent: It feels like after the character of Bruno was introduced, it's like a crash course between like … she – Mirabel – frees Isabela from her mental constraints of perfection or whatever and then she fights with her abuela but then she makes up and then the house goes down and she makes up with her abuela and then she’s like, “I love you all anyway.”

Bailey: It did happen very fast.

Trent: It's like we didn't see … once again, the showing not telling it's like … we didn't actually see the character development happen. It was just kind of like …

Bailey: Before they got their powers back as well. That's the thing is, now we see that, yay, they all like understand that they just see their family.

Trent: Yeah, no, narratively I feel like that would have had more of an impact.

Bailey: Yeah, I guess we're supposed to understand that now, they've grown to accept that they aren't just their powers. And so that's why they get their powers back because now they know inside they're more than their powers. That’s what they realize.

Trent (laughing): But they still have them.

Bailey: But then they get them back and so it's kind of like okay, I guess I get why they did that. But it did kind of, I don't know, maybe it's a good thing that it defied my expectations a little bit, but I don't know I think I might have liked it more if they just realized that they were all they needed and … themselves with other powers.

Trent: Obviously, I'm happy that it had a happy ending, like imagine how unsatisfying it would have been if Abuela was like, “No, I don't know what you’re talking about.”

Bailey: It's a Disney movie babes.

Trent: Of course. But I definitely wish they would have spent more time on that. On just seeing Abuela’s thought process of, “Oh wait, am I really like in the wrong here?” And then she's like, “Yes, I am.” Instead of … because it just felt like they had that fight and then Mirabel walked off to the river and then Abuela comes up and is like, “I went through a whole character arc in like five minutes off screen.”

Bailey: That’s true, but it does, I mean, I don't know, yeah. Again from the perspective of “It's a kids movie” …

Trent: It is a Disney movie. It is a kids movie, so it needs to be easy …

Bailey: Yeah, but I see what you're saying. I was all confused as well when she just pulled up and she went from being completely angry and enraged at her to, “Oh wait, I'm so sorry.”

Trent: It was like a button flipped and she was like, “You know what? I have been bad.”

Bailey: Which, good. You know, it's good that it happened. Yeah, for real. It was definitely a “good for her,” “good for them” kind of movie, so. But yeah, moving on to the soundtrack, top song, number one song …

Trent: What's your top song?

Bailey & Trent (simultaneously): “We Don't Talk About Bruno”

Trent: Yes we do.

Bailey: We do talk about how we don’t talk about Bruno …

Trent: That song is like “Let It Go.” It's the standout song. It is so good. I have had it on re-peat. Just constantly playing. And it's so good. Every single verse is, individually, it's like chef's kiss and then you get to the end and they all combine and there's so many little details in the music. Ugh, it's so good. Yeah. I swear, it’s like laced with something addictive because it is so, so good.

Bailey: That is the one song where I was listening to it and I had no critiques at all. Because I know for some of them like “Surface Pressure” I really like. That song made me very emotional and I think that actress, the voice actress, and also the character herself did a great job. I don't know, I thought it was really well portrayed and I like the fun little dancing number – I know that was kind of controversial – with the little donkeys and all that … I kind of liked it, it was fun.

Trent: I liked that it was funny but it just felt weird that she was singing about like, “I have all this anxiety” and then meanwhile she's like busting out the choreo.

Bailey: But it was kind of fun. It was representative of her inner conflict of how she has to keep going day to day feeling like this and putting on this show for everyone around her, right?

Trent: Okay. Okay.

Bailey: You know what I mean?

Trent: Come on, Socratic seminar.

Bailey: Yeah. I just think that parts of it … the production were not my favorite thing. But the lyrics and the chorus and everything … again, I don't think was perfect but I mean like all Disney soundtracks it will probably grow on me because a lot of them do after the fact. But again, “We Don’t Talk About Bruno” – elite. Top tier song. Should be in all the Disney Spotify playlists already, if it's not.

Trent: I unironically hope that it charts or something because it’s that good. Hidden gem: “What Else Can I Do?” It’s little bit repetitive, I think. But it's a little bit poppier. It's a bit more upbeat. I think it’s fun.

Bailey: Yeah, I thought all the songs were great, again, but “We Don’t Talk About Bruno” for sure the standout, and then “Surface Pressure,” again, I loved the chorus. Everything else …

Trent: I will say, that first song that I was ragging on, “The Family Madrigal” …

Bailey: It’s good.

Trent: It's expository, but the song itself is really fun and catchy.

Bailey: Yeah. Yeah, it was a good introduction music-wise.

Trent: But it’s a fun song. It's definitely fun. I'm definitely like, *singing* “It's time for a grandkid round up.” That part, I'm like, “Yes, get the fire going.”

Bailey: And I mean, she was kind of explaining to the kids, wasn't she? Like, that was kind of how they justified that. Wasn't she? I can't really remember. And music aside, can we talk about how the animation was beautiful?

Trent (yelling again): So high quality!

Bailey: It was gorgeous.

Trent: All the swishes of the colorful skirts.

Bailey: It was gorgeous and I think more so than any other Disney movie I've seen, all the characters had such a distinct look. It wasn't one of those movies where they use the same model and everyone looks so similar. Everyone had such a distinct look and a distinct sound, distinct hair. They all had different beautiful curls and they were all animated so individually, and the dresses and the skirts.

Trent: So gorgeous, such good character designs, such good animation. The voice actors really embody their characters.

Bailey (overlapping): And all of the nature scenes as well.

Trent: Oh my gosh, the animation was top tier. Absolutely.

Bailey: Oh my god. What was a little kid's name? He was so cute.

Trent: Which one? Oh, Antonio. The little cousin. Oh my gosh.

Bailey (overlapping): Yeah, he was so cute.

Trent: Wait, okay. Have you seen – I don't know if this is a thing on TikTok but I’ve definitely seen it on my YouTube – I think I’m on Encanto YouTube because I've seen so many fan edits of Camilo, which is the cousin. People are thirsting over him hard. Camilo and Dolores are people's favorites. There are so many fan edits. I've seen “Encanto but it's just Camilo for two minutes and 18 seconds.”

Bailey: I saw someone saying that he looks like what's his face … Wybie from Coraline.  That's all I saw about him.

Trent (overlapping): *laughs* Oh, not that. Camilo doesn’t deserve that.

Bailey: I saw a TikTok about that. And I was like .. I don’t know, I guess they’re both mischievous. That's really all I see in common with those two.

Trent: Yeah, but I’ve definitely seen so many – like on YouTube – so many edits.

Bailey: I've seen a lot of people thirsting for Luisa's voice actress, which I'm here for.

Trent (overlapping): I don’t know what she looks like but I would imagine it’s for a good reason.

Bailey: Okay, yeah, well you can definitely get up afterwards. She's beautiful and cool. Very cool.

Trent: I've heard you thirsting about Bruno. *laughs*

Bailey: Yeah. Yeah. On the record, yes. No, and I was going to say, I also have seen some Isabela ⨉ Elsa art.

Trent (wheezing): What?

Bailey: Yeah, cause a lot of people are headcanoning … making her … they believe she’s a lesbian because she didn’t want to marry what's his face, it was like a headcanon thing.

Trent: Hmmmmm. I see it, okay.

Bailey: And I don’t know about the whole Elsa thing but since, obviously, she's the other character that people kind of gravitate towards and think that she's also a lesbian, I was like, “That's kind of cute” and the art was really cool. I was like, “Okay.” I don't know, no big thoughts about that. But I was like, “Alright.” I saw like two videos about it so I thought it was worth noting.

Trent: Lowkey. Every single Disney movie like that, like Frozen, like Moana, like Encanto, they all follow the hero's journey. But the hero's journey is also a very clear allegory for coming out. So that's why, for all those who are like, “Oh my god, Elsa’s a lesbian. Oh my god …

Bailey: I’m not going to tell people what to think about them. Yeah.

Trent: … Isabela’s a lesbian.” It's like, is it supported by the text? No, but I could see it.

Bailey: Didn’t she start putting rainbow crap all over herself at the end?

Trent: *cackling*

Bailey: Yes. I’m pretty sure she did. She took her pink dress and …

Trent: The Encanto pride parade.

Bailey: Yeah, she literally started throwing all these colors on herself. I don’t know – could it be any clearer? Yes, but … *laughs*

Trent: Textually, no. Subtextually, I see it.

Bailey (accidentally mispronouncing Encanto – my sincerest apologies): Any last Encanto thoughts? Do you want to talk about some other things?

Trent (mocking): Not “En-can’t-o” …

Bailey: Um, Encanto. My bad.

Trent: The Americanization …

Bailey: You know what?

Trent: No, I liked it. Top tier. Definitely up there among the greats like Moana, Frozen, all those animated … definitely one of the good ones.

Bailey: Oh, for sure. Yeah, again as a lowkey Disney adult. I'm sorry I just love the soundtracks. I'm a huge sucker for a Disney soundtrack. I think they're so good, I'm so sorry. I'm not a sucker for you. I'm a sucker for Disney.

[“We Don’t Talk About Bruno” from Encanto]

Trent : We’re going to speedrun some smaller stuff just as it comes.

Bailey: Are you going to put that in?

Trent: Sure. We’ll keep this in too.

Bailey: Oh, okay. Yeah, topic speedrun. One two three. Let's go. No, number one – we don't talk about Bruno but you know who we do talk about?

Trent: Who?

Bailey: Elmo, because … *laughs*

Trent: Stop. Okay, I've seen so many jokes on Twitter about Elmo and his rock. Can you explain to me the source?

Bailey: Actually no, I don't understand the rock thing. I just see all these edits about – is it Dwayne “The Rock” Johnson?

Trent: I don't know. I think it's like a physical piece of stone.

Bailey: Does he have a pet rock? I thought he had a pet fish.

Trent: I don’t know. He does have a pet fish. But does he have a pet rock? Like …

Bailey: I don’t know. Elmo and The Rock? I just am here for the TikTok sounds like when he says “delicious.” That's my favorite. Do you know that one?

Trent: I’m not on TikTok so …

Bailey: *gasps* Oh my gosh, wait. Okay, so there's this audio where he's talking to – I think it's someone from the Hamilton cast because he’s like …

Trent: Of course.

Bailey: He’s singing. It's on the show, it's this clip. Yeah. And so the guy’s like, *singing* “Raise a glass to freedom,” and then Elmo’s like, I was like, “Raise a glass? Glass of what?” and then he's like, “Apple juice,” and then Elmo’s like,

Bailey & Elmo: “Delicious.”

Bailey: And it's so good. I feel like it's such a millennial thing to say but like it scratches my brain. So beautiful. NBC News has an article about it – “Elmo’s feud with a pet rock.”

Trent: Lowkey, I love when celebrities go on Sesame Street. Like there was a clip of Billie Eilish on Sesame Street. I was like …

Bailey: *gasps* Oh my gosh … I do remember the rock now. Rocco! I do remember he has a pet fish and a pet rock I think. Okay, so I don't know why he's feuding. It must just be some clip of them beefing. I just love Elmo. I just think he's so great. I used to have a Tickle Me Elmo when I was little and I was a huge Sesame Street stan.

Trent: That explains a lot.

Bailey: Rosita was my favorite, I think. If I remember correctly. I loved her.

Trent: I feel like I should know who that is.

Bailey: She's the blue one? Fuzzy one?

Trent: I think they’re all fuzzy.

Bailey: Okay, but … you know, that's not a great descriptor, actually, yeah.

Trent: They're fuzzy. Okay? Can I get an actual detail?

Bailey: No, but I do. I love Sesame Street. I was gonna say something else … oh, I dressed up in middle school. We dressed up as Sesame Street characters. I think I was …

Trent: In middle school.

Bailey: My friend Rachel … yeah it was, it was like seventh grade or something. And we thrifted these shirts and I went as … it was the two gay ones. Sorry.

Trent: *laughs* Bert and Ernie?

Bailey: Bert and Ernie … I was Ernie. I was Ernie, she was Bert.

Trent: Listen, in the Sesame Street canon, they are …

Bailey: They’re kind of gay.

Trent: … asexual. No, they're asexual puppets. They are puppets who don't experience attraction cause they're not people. But no, they're gay. Headcanon.

Bailey: But I will say, this is not necessarily relevant, but I was always more of a Muppet girl because The Muppets from 2011 that movie …

Trent: Oh my God, Miss Piggy.

Bailey: … formed my, shaped my life. “Man or Muppet.”

Trent: Miss Piggy’s an icon.

Bailey: Yeah. That whole movie I have practically memorized and it's so great. And if you've never seen it – have you ever seen it?

Trent: You're gonna yell at me.

Bailey: *gasps* NOOOOOOO.

Trent: Every single movie that you like I have not … you just have to assume that I have not seen it.

Bailey: Genuinely when I was narrowing down my Letterboxd “Top Four” I almost put The Muppets in there.

Trent: I do not have an enriched film vocabulary.

Bailey: So, we're watching Ma. We're watching The Muppets (2011). Pick another poster, we can watch any of these.

Trent: Oh, I’ve never seen Jennifer’s Body. My friend tried to make me watch it but I didn’t.

Bailey: Okay, Jennifer’s Body.

Trent: We’ll watch Phoebe Bridgers. No, just kidding.

Bailey: Yeah, we’ll watch Phoebe Bridgers. Have you ever seen Aquamarine?

Trent: Yes, oh my god.

Bailey: Classic.

Trent: That one’s great.

Bailey: That is what made me a Weezer stan, I think, subconsciously when I was like … I used to watch it on my iPod Nano. The screen was like this big and that's why I'm blind now because I would watch it on my iPod Nano. Oh, wait. Okay, speaking of older movies, I think I told you this, but I rewatched the Divergent series.

Trent: You did tell me and I haven't seen it.

Bailey: Yeah. Did you ever read it?

Trent: No. I did watch … it was like a “Cinema Sins.” Wait, maybe I did watch the first one.

Bailey: Oh, there’s so many sins.

Trent: I remember like intermittent clips. I don't know if I watched the movie or if I watched like a Cinema Sins review of the movie or an analysis of why it’s bad. I don't know, something like that. But Veronica Roth, if you're listening, we at NBN, we remember you. We love you.

Bailey (overlapping): Yeah, come on our podcast.

Trent: We staNBN. Come on our podcast. You can call in.

Bailey: Yeah. Although I will say, those movies, gosh golly gee, they're pretty not good. They weren't as bad as I thought they were gonna be because I'm a huge Hunger Games stan. I think those movies are incredible. Some of the best young adult movie adaptations ever if not the best. Harry Potter is also up there. I watched that over break – the Harry Potter thing that came out of HBO Max. Did you see that?

Trent: Oh, the documentary? That was like very … J. K. Rowling-free.

Bailey: It was pretty good … they used an old interview clip of her but, rightfully so, it was pretty J. K.-free.

Trent: Someone in one of my Zoom classes talked about it and they were like, “There was one clip of J. K. Rowling but it was clearly dated.”

Bailey: It was. They dated it. 2019.

Trent: But you knew it was not recent because J. K. Rowling is like … over-canceled. She's like super canceled.

Bailey: Yeah, well and so overall that in particular … because I watched with my mom and I sobbed. Like, I bawled, and so to my mom and she's not even like a huge Harry Potter fan or anything.

Trent: I’m not either. Everything you like, I’m like, I’m like never engaged in this.

Bailey: I’m so sorry! I read them … they were like big series that I liked in like third grade/middle school. I was a huge. I really was. Ravenclaw. Not to be millennial in the chat but I am in fact a Ravenclaw … anyone out there?

Trent: When you go to Northwestern!

Bailey: Yeahhhhhh.

Trent: No, sorry.

Bailey: No, so I didn’t think it was the best documentary. It wasn’t, like, amazingly produced or anything to be honest. I mean, there were some good parts.

Trent: Not you flaming them. “It was poorly put together …

Bailey (loudly over Trent): BUT IT WAS KIND OF MESSY. Okay, they used – DID YOU SEE – okay, LET ME JUSTIFY MYSELF.

Trent: … J. K. Rowling was in it.”

Bailey: Let me justify myself because they used a photo of – speaking of Aquamarine – they used a photo of Emma Roberts instead of Emma Watson when she was a child. It was horrible. It was horrible and there were some other things as well that wasn’t the best but, that being said, the actors bring the emotion. [The producers] took the actors and put them in the different sets and just had them talk to each other so they didn’t have to do anything. The actors did it for them. That was great. That was great, but Divergent? Ehhhhh.

Trent: Veronica Roth, we love you.

Bailey: Veronica, we love you. If anyone wants to go rewatch Divergent, which I highly recommend because it was a fun experience, the worldbuilding is shi– terri– bad.

Trent (over Bailey): *loud laughter*

Bailey (also laughing): It’s bad. After thinking about The Hunger Games, Harry Potter

Trent: Doesn’t it take place in Chicago?

Bailey (laughing): Yeah.

Trent: So like … what’s Northwestern doing in the Divergent universe?

Bailey (hysterical): I don’t know … I don’t know what we’re doing there.

Trent: What’s it … what’s it called?

Bailey: We’re probably with the evil smart people.

Trent: Yeah, what are they called?

Bailey: Erudite? Erudite.

Trent: Erudite. I was going to say Evangelical.

Bailey: Yeah, we’re the … we’re the Evangelicals.

Trent: We’re the erudites, Northwestern.

Bailey: No, but I do recommend watching the first movie, because I did in fact purchase it on Amazon so I can watch it whenever I want without ads BECAUSE the enemies to lovers with Theo James as Four and with Shailene Woodley is incredible. It’s so good. That they do build up well. Everything else about it … not so much. Divergent, sorry we love you but.

Trent: Okay, okay, any last minute … anything else you want to talk about before we send off?

Bailey: I don’t have anything big and crazy. I will say though, in the next episode I do maybe want to talk about Euphoria, even though I know you haven’t seen it, because it’ll be topical – season two is coming out tomorrow. Even though, I mean, it’s coming out tomorrow whenever this is up it will have come out. But, yeah, I have a lot of thoughts about Euphoria. Anyone who watches Euphoria has a lot of thoughts about Euphoria, and I’m making my roommate watch it for the first time. We’re going to finish it tonight probably and it’s a great show. It has many flaws, but it’s a great show. With great acting. It really is.

Trent: I just want to say I haven’t seen it but the stuff that they get up to … I was not doing any of that in high school. Was I missing out? Should I have been doing hard drugs in high school?

Bailey: I was going to say, not to be a Medill kid in the chat but I was grinding on the school yearbook …

Trent: No, fully.

Bailey: … I was not doing hard drugs. My hard drug was, in fact, yearbook.

Trent: Oh my gosh, at the BHS news … Mr. Nellis if you’re listening, this is where you got me.

Bailey: I saw a TikTok that was so funny, it was like, “Do these kids ever, like …

Trent: … do homework?”

Bailey: … okay well, that. But no kids in shows ever do homework. If anything they’ll be doing homework when the scene begins and then they leave it. But they were like, “Do these kids ever just go get coffee? Go get boba?” No, they go get literal molly. That’s what they do. Babe.

Trent (imitating a Euphoria high schooler): “Let’s get some ecstasy.”

Bailey: I was telling my roommate when we were rewatching it because we’re almost … we have two episodes left, basically, and I was like, “You know what I want to do? I want to give all of these characters a hug.”

Trent: No, for real. For real.

Bailey: Because they need it. They need it. They all do …

Trent: Hunter Schafer and Zendaya, I like … I just want to sit them down and be like …

Bailey (interrupting, oops): … every character, well, except Nate. Every character … every other character. *sees Trent does not know who Nate is* Jacob Elordi.

Trent: I don’t know who that is.

Bailey: Okay. Kissing Booth??? C’mon …

Trent: I just want to sit them down and be like, “What do you need in your life? Do you need support? Do you need a hug? Do you like … what … where did we go wrong?”

Bailey: Yeah. Specifically all of the women. Like you said, Hunter Schafer, Sydney Sweeney … I know we’re saying the actors’ names but not the characters’ names, but whatever … Cassie … whatever. I want to give them all a large hug. So badly.

Trent: Okay, maybe Euphoria episode next time.

Bailey: Mmhmm. Yeah.

Trent: Also, at some point, we are going to do a Taylor Swift episode.

Bailey: We are going to do a Taylor Swift episode. HOPEFULLY when the next Taylor’s Version drops, which, knock on wood, is going to be Speak Now.

Trent: *knocks on wood*

Bailey: Mmhmm.

Trent: No, knock on wood it’s going to be 1989. *knocks on wood again*

Bailey: Noooo, Speak Now.

Trent: Because we’re both closet Swifties.

Bailey: We are. We are.

Trent: If you’re my friends and you’re listening to this, redact that.

Bailey: You are not a “closet Swiftie.” You posted your top artists on … everyone knows. Everyone knows. Everyone knows babe.

Trent: Out and proud as a Swiftie. Okay, but I think that’s it. We’re already at the half-hour mark. So, if you listened all the way through and you’re here, we love you. You are a real one.

Bailey: Mmhmm.

Trent: Let one of us know because that probably means you know us in real life, if you’re listening to this point.

Bailey: Yeah. Follow … we don’t have a podcast … any sort of social media but follow NBN …

Trent (overlapping): Follow North by Northwestern on social media. Follow our twitter.

Bailey: Follow us on Instagram if you feel like it. My Instagram is @baeisforbailey.

Trent: Mine is @trent_br0wn.

Bailey: Because I’m sure I’ll be posting about this podcast on our Instagram so feel free to follow them as well.

Trent: Alright, I think that’s all we got so thank you for listening and … cue the outro music.

[“We Don’t Talk About Bruno,” from Encanto]